It’s back to school for most, and planning for speedy and healthy lunches is imperative whether your kiddos are physically attending school or staying home. And if you’re like us here, easy lunches are the best lunches. Enter the mighty sandwich. Sandwiches slathered with crunchy peanut butter—you’re not eating smooth peanut butter, are you?—and homemade jelly, a mozzarella, tomato, and basil layer-cake-sandwich, or a classic tuna salad sandwich are always on rotation here.
But taking the humble sandwich to the next level requires the ideal bread. It helps the mundane transcend the standard measure. And while this site has pan bread recipes abound (I guess I do love good pan bread), this tangzhong sandwich bread is so delightful it’s quickly floated to the top choice for, as my kids call it, “square bread.”
That’s not to say my classic pain de mie or whole-grain pan loaf isn’t a treat, but this bread brings a certain softness to the crumb that’s hard to achieve without high hydration or added enrichments. And yet, in pre-cooking a portion of the total flour used in this recipe, you’ll do just that.
This pre-cooking technique, commonly called tangzhong, is classic for enriched bread such as Japanese-style shokupan (milk bread), and it’s a handy technique for bringing a level of softness to a loaf without excessive fat or oil addition. A healthier version, if you will.
What is Tangzhong (Pre-cooked Flour)?
The tangzhong technique (also known as water roux or simply pre-gelatinized flour) is cooking raw flour and a liquid to approximately 150°F (65°C). At this temperature, the starches in the flour will gelatinize, similar to how the exterior of a bagel gelatinizes when you boil the dough. This process turns the mixture into a sticky starch paste added to the dough during mixing and brings incredible softness to the final baked bread.
This upfront cooking is a small step at the beginning of this recipe, but one that results in more tender and fluffy bread without the need for other enrichments such as butter, oil, or eggs.
A quick roundup of the benefits of incorporating pre-cooked flour (or tangzhong) in your bread dough:
- Adds tenderness and an open interior without the use of eggs, butter, or sugar
- The dough can have lower hydration but still achieve a soft texture
- Prolongs the shelf life of the bread (and coupled with natural fermentation, which already preserves, this might be the best sandwich bread yet)
Check out my guide to making tangzhong for more information on this technique.
In the top left, the flour and milk are combined and whisked vigorously over medium-low heat. After a few minutes, the top-right shows the mixture starts to thicken. Continue to whisk, and don’t worry if you find small clumps here and there. The bottom-right shows the mixture sufficiently thickened and ready to remove from the flame. It will feel similar to a cooked porridge and be hard to whisk any further. Then, let the tangzhong mixture cool and add it as any other ingredient during mixing.
Flour Selection
Any medium-protein bread flour (around 11% protein) or all-purpose flour will work well in this recipe. I’ve made this with King Arthur Baking All-purpose with excellent results. And similarly, for the whole wheat portion, any whole wheat flour will work well.
Baking Schedule
This tangzhong pan bread is a direct bake, meaning it’s baked the same day you mix (except for the levain, which is created the night before).
Overnight proof option: while I don’t call for this dough to be retarded (cold proof overnight), this can be done if it’s better for your schedule. Simply place it in the fridge after it’s shaped and in the Pullman pan, then bake first thing in the morning.
Tangzhong Sandwich Bread Formula
For tips on how to calculate baker’s percentages or how to modify this formula, see my post on baker’s percentages (baker’s math).
| Total Dough Weight | 1,800 grams |
| Pre-fermented Flour | 11.00% |
| Levain in final dough | 25.96% |
| Yield | 2 x 900g pan loaves |
I love using my 9x4x4″ USA Pan Pullman pan (without the lid) for sandwich bread. Not only does the nonstick liner mean the loaves always remove cleanly, its straight sides mean neat slices perfect for sandwiches or toast.
But if you’re looking for how to make this recipe work in a different pan, see my post on shaping a sandwich loaf.
Total Formula
Desired dough temperature: 77°F (25°C). See my post on the importance of dough temperature for more information on dough temperatures.
The rows marked tangzhong below are the two ingredients cooked ahead of time, but they are still counted toward the formula’s overall percentages. In other words, the 8% whole wheat flour is still counted toward the total flour in the formula and is not an “extra” addition.
| Weight | Ingredient | Baker’s Percentage |
|---|---|---|
| 74g | Tangzhong: Whole wheat flour (Giusto’s Whole Wheat Flour) | 8.0% |
| 296g | Tangzhong: Whole milk | 32.0% |
| 693g | Medium-protein bread flour or All-purpose flour (~11% protein, Central Milling Artisan Baker’s Craft or King Arthur Baking All-Purpose) | 75.0% |
| 157g | Whole wheat flour (Giusto’s Whole Wheat) | 17.0% |
| 65g | Olive oil | 7.0% |
| 37g | Honey | 4.0% |
| 453g | Water | 49.0% |
| 17g | Salt | 1.8% |
| 10g | Sourdough starter | 1.1% |
Tangzhong Sandwich Bread Method
1. Prepare Levain – Night before mixing, 9:00 p.m. (Day one)
| Weight | Ingredient | Baker’s Percentage |
|---|---|---|
| 101g | Medium protein bread flour or all-purpose flour | 100.0% |
| 101g | Water | 100.0% |
| 10g | Ripe sourdough starter | 10.0% |
Mix the following ingredients in a container and leave covered to ripen at about 78°F (25°C) for 12 hours overnight.
2. Prepare the tangzhong (pre-cook flour) – 8:00 a.m. (Day two)
| Weight | Ingredient |
|---|---|
| 74g | Whole wheat flour |
| 296g | Whole milk |
Be sure to do this ahead of time to give the pre-cooked flour time to cool before mixing.
Milk alternative: If you want to avoid using milk in this recipe, substitute out the dairy milk in the roux, below, for water (or something like oat milk).
To a medium saucepan, add the flour and milk listed above. Turn the heat to medium-low and cook, whisking continuously, until the mixture thickens and becomes like a paste, about 5-8 minutes. In the beginning, whisk vigorously to break up any flour clumps, and be diligent about this near the end to avoid burning. The mixture won’t seem to do anything until it reaches a critical heat point, be patient; it will thicken.
Once it transforms into a viscous paste (something like oatmeal porridge), remove the pan from the heat and spread it out on a small plate to expedite cooling. Set the tangzhong aside until called for when mixing.
3. Mix – 9:00 a.m.
I used my KitchenAid stand mixer to mix this dough, but it’s possible to make this bread without a stand mixer by mixing everything together by hand in a mixing bowl. To do this, you’ll need to mix for around 10-15 minutes, depending on your technique (slap and fold will work really well!).
| Weight | Ingredient |
|---|---|
| All | Tangzhong (see Tangzhong above) |
| 591g | Medium-protein bread flour |
| 157g | Whole wheat flour |
| 65g | Olive oil |
| 37g | Honey |
| 351g | Water |
| 17g | Salt |
| 213g | Levain (see Prepare Levain, above) |
Mixing water temperature note: I used cold water from the fridge to mix this dough, mostly because my pre-cooked flour was not fully cool by the time I needed to mix. Be sure to take the temperature of the pre-cooked flour and other ingredients into account to get close to the final dough temperature listed for this recipe.
Use my mixing water temperature calculator to quickly help you determine what to heat or cool your water to so it meets the desired dough temperature for this recipe.
To the bowl of a stand mixer fitted with the dough hook attachment, add the pre-cooked flour, flour, water, ripe levain, honey, olive oil, and salt. Mix on low speed for approximately 2 minutes until the ingredients come together, and no dry bits remain. Increase the mixer speed to medium (2 on a KitchenAid) and mix for 8-10 minutes until the dough starts to clump up around the dough hook. It won’t completely remove from the bottom of the bowl, and it will still be shaggy. See the image of my dough right after transferring to its bulk fermentation container.
Transfer your dough to a bulk fermentation container and cover.
4. Bulk Fermentation – 9:15 a.m. to 12:45 p.m.
At room temperature, around 72-74°F (22-23°C), bulk should take about 3 1/2 hours. Give this dough three sets of stretch and folds during bulk fermentation (first rise) at 30-minute intervals, where the first set starts after 30 minutes from the start of bulk fermentation. For each set, wet your hands, grab one side and stretch it up and over the dough to the other side. Rotate the bowl 180° and perform another stretch and fold (this forms a long rectangle in the bowl). Then, rotate the bowl 90° and do another stretch and fold. Finally, turn the bowl 180° and do one last stretch and fold. You should have the dough neatly folded up in the bowl.
After the third set, let the dough rest for the remainder of bulk fermentation.
5. Divide and Pre-shape – 12:45 p.m.
Uncover your bulk fermentation container and gently scrape the dough out of the bowl onto a clean work surface. Using a bench knife, divide the dough directly in half and pre-shape each piece into a loose round. Let the rounds relax uncovered for 30 minutes.
6. Shape – 1:15 p.m.
First, lightly oil your Pullman pans with olive oil or another neutral oil. While this isn’t strictly necessary when using a USA Pan Pullman pan, it’s a little insurance just in case.
I shaped this dough in my typical method for shaping a pan loaf. Check out my guide to shaping pan loaves for detailed instruction.
Once the dough is shaped into a long tube, transfer each to their pan, seam-side-down. At this point, you can sprinkle on any toppings you’d like, I added white sesame seeds to one loaf, and instant oats to the other.
7. Proof – 1:30 p.m. to 3:30 p.m. (2 hours room temperature)
Cover the pans with a large, reusable plastic bag and seal shut. Let the dough proof at room temperature, around 72-74°F (22-23°C), for 2 hours.
Overnight proof option: before the 2 hour counter proof, cover the pans with bags and place them in your home refrigerator to proof overnight. Bake them the next morning as indicated below. Expect a slightly more sour flavor.
8. Bake – 3:30 p.m. (pre-heat oven at 3:00 p.m.)
Check on your dough: it should have risen just below the top of the Pullman pan and be very light and airy to the touch (see above). If it’s not quite there, give it another 15 minutes and check again.
I steamed the oven for this bake as described on my post on baking with steam in a home oven.
Preheat your oven, with rack at the bottom third run and a pan with lava rocks on the bottom, to 400°F (205°C).
Once your oven is preheated, remove your proofed loaves from their bags and slide them into the oven. Carefully pour a cup of ice into the pan with lava rocks at the bottom of the oven and quickly close the oven door.
Bake at 400°F (205°C) for 20 minutes with steam. After this time, vent the oven, remove the steaming pan(s), and close the oven door. Bake for an additional 30-35 minutes until the top is well-colored and the internal temp is around 205°F (96°C). Remove the pans and gently knock out the loaves onto a wire rack. Return the loaves to the oven to bake for an additional 5 minutes without their pans to add extra color to the bottom and sides.
Let the loaves cool for 2 hours before slicing to ensure the interior is fully set. These will store incredibly well as described in my post on how to store bread.
This bread has a delightful flavor that has little sourness. The overnight, mild levain with all white flour helped to this end as did the direct bake (no overnight cold-proof). The sourness that does slyly peek through comes at you at the very end of each bite, a gentle, but welcome, pop of flavor.
What I love about this bread—besides the tender interior, flavors created through natural fermentation, and flavorful, wheaty abundance, of course—is the shatteringly thin crust that forms when a slice is toasted (see above). We have the Pullman pan to thank here, and while a mouth-melting slice of bread is delightful, the added crunch in each slice is downright satisfying. And I think this might be the secret success of this bread: it’s soft, without excessive oil, eggs, or butter, for kiddos to love it, but still shores up enough strength to carry any ingredient you throw at it.
As I finish typing up these final words, I still can’t get the idea of crunchy peanut butter out of my mind. Shall we confess it’s time, yet again, for another amped-up PB&J? Buon appetito!
Tangzhong Sourdough Sandwich Bread
- Prep Time: 19 hours
- Cook Time: 55 minutes
- Total Time: 19 hours 55 minutes
- Yield: 2 loaves
- Category: Sourdough, Sandwich Bread
- Cuisine: American
Description
This bread has a delightful flavor that has little sourness. The overnight, mild levain with all white flour helped to this end as did the direct bake (no overnight cold-proof). The sourness that does slyly peek through comes at you at the very end of each bite, a gentle, but welcome, pop of flavor.
What I love about this bread—besides the tender interior, flavors created through natural fermentation, and flavorful wheaty abundance, of course—is the shatteringly thin crust that forms when a slice is toasted (see above). We have the Pullman pan to thank here, and while a mouth-melting slice of bread is delightful, the added crunch in each slice is downright satisfying. And I think this might be the secret success of this bread: it’s soft, without excessive oil, eggs, or butter, for kiddos to love it, but still shores up enough strength to carry any ingredient you throw at it.
Ingredients
Levain
- 101g medium-protein bread flour
- 101g water
- 10g ripe sourdough starter
Tangzhong
- 74g whole wheat flour
- 296g whole milk
Main Dough
- all the tangzhong
- 591g medium-protein bread flour or all-purpose flour
- 157g whole wheat flour
- 65g extra virgin olive oil
- 37g honey
- 351g water
- 17g salt
- all the levain
Instructions
- Prepare levain (Day one, the night before mixing, 9:00 p.m.)
In a small container, mix together the levain ingredients and keep at 78°F (26°C) for 12 hours. - Prepare the Tangzhong (Day two, 8:00 a.m.)
Add the tangzhong ingredients to a medium-size saucepan. Turn the heat to medium-low and cook, whisking continuously, until the mixture thickens and becomes like a paste, about 5-8 minutes. - Mix (9:00 a.m.)
To the bowl of a stand mixer fitted with the dough hook attachment add the Main Dough ingredients. Mix on low speed for approximately 2 minutes until the ingredients come together, and no dry bits remain. Increase the mixer speed to medium (2 on a KitchenAid) and mix for 8-10 minutes until the dough starts to clump up around the dough hook. It won’t completely remove from the bottom of the bowl, and it will still be shaggy. Transfer your dough to a bulk fermentation container and cover. - Bulk Fermentation (9:15 a.m. to 12:45 p.m.)
Give the dough 3 sets of stretch and folds at 30-minute intervals, where the first set starts 30 minutes after the start of bulk fermentation. - Divide and Preshape (12:45 p.m.)
Scrape out the dough, divide it in half, and preshape each half into a loose round. Let rest for 30 minutes, uncovered. - Shape (1:15 p.m.)
Lightly oil two 9x4x4-inch Pullman pans with olive oil or neutral oil. Shape each piece of dough into a tube shape and transfer it to the pan. Top with sesame seeds, rolled oats, etc. - Proof (1:30 p.m. to 3:30 p.m. at room temperature)
Cover the pans with reusable plastic and seal shut. Let the dough proof for 2 hours at 72-74°F (22-23°C). - Bake (3:30 p.m.)
Preheat your oven, with a rack at the bottom third run and a pan with lava rocks on the bottom, to 400°F (205°C). Bake at 400°F (205°C) for 20 minutes with steam. After this time, vent the oven, remove the steaming pan(s), and close the oven door. Bake for an additional 30-35 minutes until the top is well-colored and the internal temp is around 205°F (96°C). Remove the pans and gently knock out the loaves onto a wire rack. Return the loaves to the oven to bake for an additional 5 minutes without their pans to add extra color to the bottom and sides. Let the loaves cool for 2 hours on a wire rack before slicing.
Notes
This bread can also be proofed overnight to bake the next day. At the proof step (#7), instead of proofing on the counter, retard the dough to the fridge (covered). Any time the next day, remove the dough from the fridge and bake straight away.
A full-fat nut or oat milk or water can be used to make the tangzhong.
What’s Next?
For another tangzhong recipe, check out our ultra-soft and delectable sourdough cardamom rolls.
506 Comments
Hey Maurizio, wouldnt it be better to knead the dough until it reaches the windowpane stage? (I’m mixing this dough by hand tomorrow!). I mean, why not develop more strength in the dough, is there a reason?
Also, can I use melted butter instead of olive oil?
You can absolutely do this! I prefer to go to perhaps an improved mix in the machine, then finish it off with a few sets of stretch and fold during bulk, just to keep hands on the dough and redistribute temperature in the bulk container. But yes, you can certainly mix in the machine.
Melted butter should work just fine!
Namaste from India!!love your bakes and
you explain so very well. I’m allergic to eggs. How much pre cooked flour would be required to make the bombolini recipe eggfree? Thanks!!<
Thank you, Grishma! That’s very hard to answer, I don’t think there will be a 1-to-1 substitution there, it would require testing on my part to give you an answer!
Thank you for replying!!will wait for it whenever you post.
I’ve been meaning to make this vegan version for some time now, and the recipe uses soft or silken tofu to replace the eggs. The author describes it this way:
Eggs:
Well you can omit eggs altogether! But it is going to take that extra richness away and we don’t want that, right! So my substitute for eggs in this recipe is tofu. I am using silken tofu. It can be either soft or firm, doesn’t really matter. This adds protein to the dough, same as egg white.
You are a mad genius, Maurizio! I made this bread with all purpose flour and almond milk, and it came out perfectly. I can’t believe how crispy the crust is, how fluffy the crumb is, or how strong the structure is. Thank you so much for the recipe; this is going to be my go-to sandwich loaf for my preschooler’s lunches!
Wonderful, Jake! Happy to hear that. I haven’t tried with almond water yet, adding that to my list of dairy alternative successes. Thanks and enjoy! On a side note, hope preschool is going well. I have one in kindergarten and it’s been tough with remote work… He just has a hard time sitting in front of an iPad all day!
Hi Maurizio! I was so excited to make this recipe but I tried the proof in the fridge and it didn’t rise at all! Was I supposed to rise it on the counter for 2 hours after the overnight firdge proof??
Christina—no, you shouldn’t have had to do that, but it really depends on the dough! If you took it out in the morning and it was still dense, heavy, and not risen at all (it’s ok if there’s not a huge rise in the fridge overnight, this is to be expected, but some rise is desired), give it more time on the counter before baking! Proof it until a poke very slowly fills partly back in, the dough should be very soft and well-fermented.
Hi Maurizio – Just wow! I’ve already made this twice and the loaves just disappear! I used KAF Bread Flour + Honey the first time and Bob’s Red Mill Bread Flour + Agave Syrup the next time and both came out perfect – was surprised how much they rise up! I just used rectangular cake pans that I had – still came out close to perfect! Would it be ok to increase the percentage of WW flour? Also how would you suggest modifying it if I want to use Einkorn flour! Thanks so much for this recipe, after 2 months of loving my sourdough bread my kids now wants me to only bake this bread!
the first time I used water for the tangzhong and the second time Califia barista almond milk … worked beautifully!
I have almond milk and oak milk on my list to try—thanks for reporting back!
I just got a call from a friend who sampled a slice, she
requesteddemanded that I bake a fresh batch ASAP! Can’t wait to experiment with upping the WW percentage etcHuge compliment right there!
Makes me happy to hear that! Yes, you could start to increase the WW percentage in this recipe or use einkorn. I would move in that direction slowly, adjusting the rise time as needed (with WW you’ll find a more active dough and will eventually need to modify the levain build or pre-fermented flour percentage to avoid over proofing, or other parameters, to avoid over proofing). I’d say a 5-10% increase in WW should be ok, just keep an eye on the dough!
Delicious! Made two and gave one to my daughter for (hopefully) school lunches. I’ve also sent the recipe to my 16 year old granddaughter who has been baking sourdough since the ‘shut-down’ started, even successfully making her own starter. I followed the recipe except I used 2% milk. Note to self for next time: I didn’t pre-cook the flour long enough and it was a bit thin. I persisted through a pretty sticky dough, baking one in my new Pullman pan after a 2 hour rise on the counter and the second in a pyrex loaf pan after a cold overnight proof. I used an egg wash and each loaf had a beautiful spring in the oven although I was doubtful since neither of the loaves came up close to the rim of the pan. Bottom line – I’ll be baking this a lot! Can’t wait for a grilled cheese sandwich.
Right on, Susan! I haven’t tried with 2% but that should work just fine. Yes, if it’s under-cooked it’ll be more runny and bring less strength to the dough in the end. Sounds like you made due and came out just fine. Thanks for that feedback and happy baking!
Dear Sir, I have tried the recipes above…everything is perfectly…except the level of sourness is still a bit on the high side. Not that cannot tolerate…but still prefer an almost zero sourness or even pretty close to a very very mild sour taste. What do you suggest, any chances to tweak the starter ratio ( starter ratio to total dough volume), or starter final feeding(levain) to 1:5:5 ? Meaning less mature starter, less sour ? it this suppose to work like this ? kindly provide some guidance. thanks alot and take care
Be sure to maintain your starter with regular refreshments to avoid an overly acidic starter, but the bulk of this will be impacted by the levain itself. You could try using a faster levain build, perhaps even a 3-hour build, to reduce bacterial activity. Make the build with 100% white flour, 100% inoculation (ripe starter), and I would do 100% water. That should be ready in 3 hours around 78F (25°C). You could then try reducing the final dough temperature to 76F (24C) and extend bulk as necessary. Definitely do not do an overnight proof, bake that same day when ready for the oven. Let me know how it goes!
Hi Maurizio,
Thank you so much for this recipe! I’ve been on the search for the perfect sourdough sandwich loaf for my kids and this turned out great. I have to say that I did make a change, though; I used the yudane method instead of tangzhong! I just really wanted to try it and also felt too lazy to stand there making a porridge 😅
So, I kept all the amounts of each ingredient, but instead of mixing wheat flour and milk into a porridge for the pre-cook, I mixed bread flour and boiling water (just pour boiling water over the flour in a bowl and stir till fully hydrated). It was a 1:1 ratio at 20% of the total weight of flour and 20% of the total weight of liquid (milk + water). I didn’t know whether I should count the flour and water from the levain in my calculation, but the difference seemed fairly insignificant, so I’m guessing either is fine.
I read that it’s better to make a yudane hours ahead of time too, so I made it in the evening and refrigerated it until the next morning. I suspect the same could be done with a tangzhong! My levain wasn’t quite ready when I got up, so I popped the tangzhong into the oven at 85 degrees so it could warm up in the meantime.
The texture of the bread is fantastic! Perfect for sandwiches. And the toast is amazing 🤤 Thanks again for a great recipe!!
You’re very welcome, Kelly! Nothing wrong with using yudane method! I’ve been playing with this as well. I like your adjustments, and yes, I would likely let the roux rest overnight, especially if it’s going to be really warm from the boiling water (just like tangzhong, it’s best to let it come to room temp so it doesn’t impact the FDT, unless you need to).
Thanks for all that info and the feedback, Kelly!
Thank you, Maurizio, for providing yet another awesome recipe to the sourdough community! I have a somewhat silly question about the term “ripe sourdough starter”. This is often referred to when making the levain and I’m wondering if you could define the term, “ripe”? Does this mean that you’ve fed your starter within the past ~24 hours – or – does it refer to starter that has been sitting unfed, say in the fridge, for > 48 hours (maybe even up to a couple weeks)? Thanks again!
He defines it in his starter maintenance guide. A ripe starter is one that has risen to its maximum height after being fed, typically after about 12 hours or so depending on room temperature. I use the weekend baking guide and consider it mature after 2-3 feedings.
Thank you for the reply….very helpful!
Ripe as when I’d normally give it a refreshment, it’s a starter that’s very well fermented and showing signs it needs fresh flour and water: bubbles on top and the sides, a sour aroma, and a loose consistency. Definitely a starter that’s been on the counter and red regularly (not from the refrigerator!).
What is medium protein bread flour? KAF is 12.7% protein. I have centralmilling APF which is around 10%. Should I have used a mix of bread and APF?
He mentioned above the Central Milling Artisan Baker’s Craft, which is 11.5% and the KAF AP flour which is 11.7%. I used the Central Milling one and it came out great. Which Central Milling flour do you have? I’ve never seen one on their site specifically labeled as AP.
Don’t they suggest that beehive is resold as an ap flour?
Yes, Beehive is their “ap” offering, but the distinction between the two is hazy. Our flour classification system in the USA is very vague and hard to understand at times; I usually list AP as an alternative to CM ABC even though they list ABC as “Bread flour” because bread flour tends to have a connotation it’s higher protein flour.
Yep, apologies. When I placed my pandemic panic order earlier in the year, I didn’t notice the beehive line.
@laurengreenspon:disqus is correct, below, CM does list Beehive as “ap” — but I see them as very similar!
Pastry flour would be a little too soft for this bread, I’d suggest CM Artisan Baker’s Craft (as I listed in the recipe, above), or King Arthur All-purpose.
This! This is the sandwich bread recipe I have been looking for! This bread has a soft but sturdy perfect crumb and really nice flavors; the Pullman gives it a neat, pretty shape. This will be a really versatile bread for family and neighbors – who aren’t crazy about “overbaked” artisan hearth breads. Thanks so much Maurizio! I did have to extend the bulk by about 50 minutes, and thanks to you I knew what to watch for. I also enjoyed using the slap and fold method of kneading, this was easier and faster in the long run than pulling out, setting up, and then cleaning my KitchenAid beast.
Thanks for all that feedback, Deidre! Really glad the loaf worked out well for. Yes, I think this would be a good candidate loaf for slap/fold, even though it’s a sticky dough it comes together quickly! Enjoy 🙂
Ha yes, I made the bread again this morning and for the slap-and-fold it was really sticky at the beginning, but I used wet hands and a dough scraper for two or three minutes, and then it came together well.
Is there a way to get the thin crisp even a bit crispier, maybe my bread knife just needs to be replaced :/ but I found the tender crust to be a little fragile to get a good knife grip and even thin-ish slice.
I also baked my as the entire 1800g loaf in a “shokupan” bread pan I bought it Japan. I think it worked well. I did the overnight proof, and baked in the morning – but took the two hours at room temp thing seriously – so I think it should have gone straight from the fridge to the oven. Yes?
I baked 25 minutes with the lid on at 400 convection, then took the lid off and lowered the heat to 350, cooking about another 20-25. I temped it out at 205F, and placed back in the oven for 5 min after removing the loaf from its pan.
Yes, I would have likely gone straight from fridge to oven, but it really depends on the dough itself and how it’s going! If you want a thicker and most substantial crust, leave it in the oven longer when out of the pan, reducing the heat if necessary to avoid burning. Sounds like it went well overall, and as always with baking, modifications for next time—happy baking, Naomi!
Just got the Pullman pan and I’m excited about trying this recipe. I don’t think I missed this question: can I use 2% instead of whole milk?
Yes, 2% milk will work well!
Hi! Big thank you, I baked this bread yesterday and it was soft and tender, a wonderful flavor. I had used thang zhong before, but not with wholemeal, but in this case it worked wonderfully. I had to increase a bit the bulking and fermentation times, but I suppose that depends a lot on your starter, how strong it is. And I used cheese whey instead of water and milk, as I always have it after preparing my queso fresco. Dough was a bit on the stickey side, but it is worth knowing the result will be so good. Thanks you again for a such a wonderful recipe.
Thanks for reporting back on your results, Emma! Sounds delicious with the whey, great idea. Enjoy!
I attempted this tonight (halved the recipe, used a 9×5 loaf pan) and expected it to not be as perfect of course but unsure why I got these massive bubbles up top with a dense bottom! Can anyone help diagnose?
http://imgur.com/gallery/tBZhxks
It looks like you likely over proofed the dough. There are a few signs your dough could have gone over: sluggish rise in the oven, the score on top of the dough might not open with a nice “ear” and instead just kind of fuse together, the interior will have lots of small holes and perhaps one or two large ones near the top (but no dense areas of unfermented flour), and finally the loaf could be a little on the sour side. Try reducing the proofing period.
I made this bread today and it was so easy and the result was wonderful. Moist and tender inside with a crispy crust. This will be my go to loaf. I made two loaves, but was wondering, can I make one loaf in a 13×4 Pullman?
I made it in a large Pullman pan yesterday. I scaled the dough up to 1250g per Maurizio’s suggestion and it came out great. Probably could’ve gone higher to 1300 or even 1350g.
Thanks for your replies! I’ll give it a try, too.
Awesome, Shermin! I’ve been recommending 1250g as that’s the dough weight proportionately scaled up, but I haven’t tested it. I’m going to very soon and report back!
I tried this recipe yesterday, and unfortunately, like my last three (2x pain de mie, 1x cinnamon raisin boule) breads, it seems like my fermentation and proofing are woefully slow. My first cinnamon raisin and pain de mie attempts worked as expected. Though my doughs seem to always be a bit shaggier than the photos here.
But now, it seems I am unable to see telltale signs that bulk fermentation is active or completed. So after a tasty, but more sour and short pain de mie last week, so I thought my starter could be sad? (but it looks happy, easily doubles or more), so I fed it twice a day for a week before making this bread (AP, WW, and/or rye).
I used the levain at what I think was peak ripeness, I used an extra 5g of starter in the levain. This dough seemed pretty wet (I used the non-revised hydration levels). I added about 40 grams more flour (still slack) and two extra sets of stretch-and-folds and let bulk fermentation go for ~5.5 hours. It still it didn’t look very fermenty, I used a clear bowl this time and not much change was visible. But, I forged ahead.
I pre-shaped and shaped and the dough felt like it was holding gas/was jiggly. But then the proofing was super slow and did not rise nearly as much as I would have expected, so after a 6 hour proof I baked the loaves (about 14 hours after making the water roux). Bubbles in the loaf during proofing (sign of a too short bulk?).
They split, I expected that but thought it might be worse to push baking to the next morning. Is this splitting due to poor shaping or underpoofing? From my story does anyone have any suggestions about what I might do to improve my bread? (I generally use Lindley Mills flour (AP, rye, super sprout wheat) and KA whole wheat, and chlorine-free water).
The bread tastes great.
photo: pullman pan after ‘proofing’ 940 g
photo: glass pan after ‘proofing’ 805 g
photo: baked
photo: cross section pullman loaf
Hey, Michael! That splitting is very interesting, indeed. I might suggest first trying the recipe as-is without using rye or sprouted wheat, just to see if we can eliminate those variables. Be sure to use your levain after 12 hours or so kept at room temperature—it should be bubbly and have a sour aroma, but not smell like “wet paint” or overly alcoholic (if it does, you need to use it sooner). If your loaf was excessively sour, it might have gone the other way and over proofed. I don’t think poor shaping is at fault here, my guess is a fermentation issue and perhaps the flour you’re using!
Thanks for the reply. To clarify, I followed you recipe except for the 5 extra grams of starter in the levain. I was trying to reveal that I feed my starter a mixture of whole wheat, rye, and AP. But … I’ve been thinking that it might be the starter. It’s active, but maybe not with the right ratio of critters to successfully/consistently raise dough. It never smells yeasty; during the ‘build up’ it smells like porridge, but then at ‘past peak’ it smells solvent-y. So, I am going to try this out again with a ‘powerhouse’ starter from a friend and see how it goes. I’ll report back. The bread is delicious, just trying to get that rise. Cheers.
Ok, sounds like a good plan to me. Keep me posted, very curious!
I’m really glad you post these types of formulas. Everyone is so obsessed with super open crumb sourdough breads these days that I think we forget just how good other styles of breads can be. I made this sandwich bread the other day based on your formula. It may have overproofed a little, but was still really great. Thank you for posting on your blog regularly. I really appreciate it!
You’re very welcome, V! It’s all about flavor and eating quality, regardless of what the interior looks like 🙂
Thanks for the feedback, I really appreciate that!
Is it possible to bake this loaf without steam?
Maurizio mentioned that you can use a loaf pan with a top or an egg wash. I used an egg wash without steam and it came out great.
I’ve made this with an egg wash and it was wonderful, just as @disqus_hldUD4GzWv:disqus suggested below.
Made this yesterday and it came out great. This will definitely replace the beginner’s sourdough as our go-to bread for sandwiches, especially as school(ish) is getting started. When mixing in the stand mixer, I found that the dough started to clump around the hook *much* quicker than 8-10 minutes — more like 2-3 minutes. I let it go for another couple of minutes, but would it be better to wait the full 8-10? stop after 2-3 if it’s clumping properly? or something in between? Also I used the egg wash since it seemed a lot easier than steam; how big a difference would steam make? Is it worth trying? Thanks!
Glad to hear that! I’ve been using it for my kid’s school lunches as well, they love it. If you’re seeing the dough clump up quickly that’s just fine, mix for less time. That’s a sign for strength in the dough, and if you’re seeing clumping earlier it might be strengthening quicker (because it’s stronger flour or could even use more water). Egg wash is just fine, I chose steam here for those who wish to avoid using eggs. Happy baking!
After cold proofing, is better to let it warm up or straight from the fridge to the oven?
Straight from fridge to oven.
2 questions: is the honey necessary because I like to avoid added sugars, and I know beginner question, but is it as simple as halving of ingredients to make only one loaf?
Halving is that straightforward, just divide everything by two! Up to you on the honey, but it is in there for a reason 🙂
Hi Maurizio, I’ve been plugging away at mastering your ‘perfect sourdough’ and have finally succeeded with bread I’m proud of and happy to eat (and share)! So yesterday I had 2 levains ripe and ready, (comparing two different strains) used one in the ‘perfect loaves’ and decided to use the other to try out this new recipe for sandwich bread.
It was certainly sloppy to start with, and I don’t have a mixer with a dough hook so it had to be by hand. Well the dough slapped far and wide, including over my husband’s
iPad and the overhead hanging pans!
But it did come together and resulted in a lovely soft and surprisingly firm dough for preshaping. I had to use a 6 inch square cake tin and a standard barcake tin, and they both baked well, the square one rising to about 4 inches.
Posted a pic for you on Instagram under my rainymilne account, the crumb isn’t as airy and open as yours but the bread is so good! Delicious and soft yet wholesome tasting, hoping some will survive from breakfast to become sandwiches.
Thank you so much for sharing all your fantastic knowledge and recipes and supporting my humble efforts with your online tools.
Glad to hear my other recipe is working out! It’s a challenging recipe, but worth the work put in. The loaf came out wonderful! Id say next time, yes, drop the water just a bit, perhaps just 50g, and see how that goes. You’ll likely get a more open interior and a lighter loaf. But it’s looking delicious from here–enjoy!
Thanks for this recipe. Do you bake with convention? So excited to bake this
You’re very welcome, Anthony! No convection with this bake.
After enjoying your other sourdough recipes, I decided to give this a shot. Mine did not rise as much as yours and seems quite heavy. You mentioned using a ripe levain, but I wonder if it was too ripe in my case? Could that be the cause?
I’d say it’s not likely too ripe, but it really depends on the rest of the process and how closely you stuck to the recipe. If the dough was excessively warm and proofed too long, yes, it could have over proofed on you! Generally, if the interior has lots and lots of little holes (with no dense spots), with perhaps some larger holes up top, it might have gone too far.
Thank you. My family loved the bread and I was being too critical of my loaves. If they were a little taller, they would have been perfect. Small holes, light and cuts beautifully. I lathered PB, honey and banana on a slice for a treat. Next time, I will heed the temp to stay below 80, like you said, for a better rise. Oh, and I wanted to share, I love the USA Pullman pans that I purchased through your link!
All of us bakers are our harshest critics! I totally understand, believe me. Aren’t those pans great? They’re seriously the best. I make everything in them, even banana bread and other quick breads. Happy baking, Louise!